CBC test for Malaclemys Terrapin – Help requested
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Hello Malaclemys terrapin lovers 🙂 I have been searching the internet for a very, very long time looking for some examples of the normal or abnormal blood values of Malaclemys terrapins. I want to compare them to the ones that I got from my vet. I had no luck at all. I was able to get values for other types of turtles and some helpful information but not exactly what I was looking for. I clearly understand that the values of these tests are not very reliable, yet I will find it very useful if any of you could share your tests results with me. I believe that the results of my tests below could be useful to some of you as well. I have a long story that I believe could be useful to you but I will write it later and figure out how to post the pictures I took. To make the story brief now I will say that my 17 years old male (I got him as a young adult and he’s been with me since 4-13-1990) Malaclemys Terrapin Tequesta was very healthy and eating well when everything started on February 2007. He just had a little sound that I thought could be the possible beginning to a RI. On July 2007 I went to my THIRD veterinarian and my terrapin was very close to death being force fed for months with an extremely swollen arm and eyes. ANTIBIOTICS… Baytril and Amik. On July he got an Enema and subcutaneous fluids and his recuperation started on the same night after the expulsion of large quantities of what looks like some type of yeast and he OPENED his eyes that night after they were closed for moths since the use of the Amik antibiotics. Yesterday he went to his follow up visit to the vet and he is doing just great! He gained 32 grams in less than a month and it starting to act as his old self. The problem; The CBC complete that is was done to him indicates that while most of tests were at adequate (?) ranges two of the values were very high: 1. HEMATOCRIT (B/E) – HCT 46 (high = 37) % 2. COMP. REPTILIAN CHEMISTRIES – BUN 199 (20-50 normal) g/dL The veterinarian told me that these indicated KIDNEY problems. The laboratory that processed these test (Antech Diagnostics) did not have any reference values for any Malaclemys terrapin and they use the blood references values from younger Pond turtles (they indicated that mine was older than any listed). So, while I think that the blood test values for my turtle are probably accurate I do no trust their accurate interpretation to their younger pond turtles values. While researching on my own hundreds of .PDFs and other sources I saw big differences between freshwater turtles and brackish water turtles that makes me believe in the probability that Malaclemys terrapin organs (kidneys and liver) could be naturally capacitated to withstand a lot more than fresh water turtles and perhaps they could actually possess or withstand higher HCT and BUN blood values. One example that I read was of an experiment in which wild terrapins survived in pure salt water for weeks and recuperated from that without any ill effects while the freshwater turtles died in a period of four days. That’s why I will like to be able to see other tests done on other terrapins, perhaps there is hope for my terrapin kidneys. Usually kidney problems are irreversible. The doctor wanted me to repeat the test once more yesterday ($185.40). I told her that I was thinking in repeating the test but not right away in such a little time. I told her I will do it in a couple of months to be sure of the results. I really plan on doing it but I will like to know if I could find a veterinarian with access to a Lab with reference samples for M. Terrapins. I live in the Los Angeles area and if you know of any vet with access to a Labs with terrapin references available please let me know. Well, here are the results of the CBC tests of my terrapin. I believe it is THE ONLY ONE AVAILABLE on the internet. It will be a great idea if this special forum for Malaclemys Terrapins could have more of them posted. Thanks for reading. 🙂 Complete CBC test for Malaclemys Terrapin – Male – 17 years old (Copied w/vet notes included) TEST REQUESTED RESULTS Ref Range UNITS REPTILE CBC pondturtle.com WBC Estimate 5.0 1000/uL RBC Morphology Normal Blood Parasites Negarive Heterosphils 81 % Heterosphils Absolute 4050 Bands 0 % Absolutes 0 Lymphocytes 6 % Absolutes 300 Monocytes 0 % Absolutes 0 Eosinophils 3 % Absolutes 150 Basophils 0 % Absolutes 0 Azurophilic Monocytes 10 % Absolute 500 Toxic Changes None Observed Thrombocyte Estimate Adequate HEMATOCRIT (B/E) HCT *** 46 (high = 37) % COMP. REPTILIAN CHEMISTRIES SGOT (AST) 305 IU/L Total Protein 5.7 g/dL Albumin 1.5 g/dL BUN *** 199 (20-50) (usu hi w//hibernation, dehydration) g/dL (End stage renal can go up) Results have been rechecked and verified. Phosphorus 4.0 mg/dL Calcium 10.6 mg/dL Glucose 130 mg/dL Sodium 130 mg/dL Potassium 5.6 meq/L Chloride 89 meq/L CPK 25 IU/L Uric Acid 2.7 (no spike as usu seen w/aminoglycosides) mg/dL Globulin 4.2 g/dL P.S. These links are very good to get a general idea of these tests: http://www.anapsid.org/labtests.html http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=1267
The elevated BUN and hematocrit might be the result of dehydration before testing. If a turtle is sick it willusuallytry to bask or bury in the sand until it is dehydrated. I would retest if everything is going well and it has been eating and swimming. DBTs can live in saltwater for their entire life. -Scott — In diamondbackterrapins@yahoogroups.com, “alubrr”
Thanks Scott, I’m really hoping for dehydration instead of permanent damage due to the huge amounts of antibiotics that he recived for months. I was really lucky that his arm got extremely swollen with the last injection of Amik that vet #2 gave him. I really panicked when I saw his swollen arm the morning after and did not gave him any of the extra Amik shots that the vet wanted me to give him. He is probably alive because of that.He’s problem resulted when his beneficial bacteria died as the result of the antibiotics. I didn’t know anything about probiotics at that time and none of my previous vets knew anything about it. It took me a long time to find out about that.I was lucky to find a website ( http://www.reptilerooms.com/Sections+index-req-viewarticle-artid-46-page-1.html ) that opened my eyes. Yes my terrapin got skin fungus and everything seem to point that he has something very similar to it. Antibiotics could not cure him, they just make him sicker.When I started with probiotics he was to the point that I thought he was to die soon and decided to go to vet #3. I explained these to the vet and she told me she never heard about this. I agreed to the CBC test and only requested an enema. She also did the subcutaneous fluids. The vet told me that nothing at all came out after the enema. As soon as I went home and place him on his recovery container he pass HUGE amounts of a white yeast like substance to the water and opened his eyes that night. It really looked as it was a miracle! During the next days he started to pass feces encapsulated in a thick white material and there was even a stage than included clear mucus until he finally started to clear up have normal like stools. Everything was soo extrange that I even took pictures of everything.Right know he looks, acts and eats very, very well. I’m going to have another CBC test done but I want to wait a month or two to be sure of the results. I will really like the test to be compared to other terrapins and not pond turtles. I have this hunch that terrapins are able to withstand and put up with more than regular freshwater turtles. Maybe I’m wrong but who knows. 🙂macrospilota
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